June 20^th is the World Refugees’ Day: we talked about the problems
of refugees immigrated to Armenia in 1988 with the Executive director of the Against
violation of law NGO Larisa Alaverdyan.

Since
1988, after the massacres in Sumgait and Baku there was a significant flow of refugees to Armenia. Were we
prepared to accept them?

No
one was prepared in the Soviet Union because it seemed that the Union is steadfast,
a great empire where the prevalence of law was unmistakable if concerned with the
state interests. No one could assume that such things may happen. In this
respect nobody was prepared.

How Armenia received the Azerbaijanian Armenian refugees, how were their residence
issues solved?

It
is important to stress out that the government of Soviet Armenia had the goal
to avoid tent refugees. On the other hand, Soviet Armenia was one of the most
progressive among other Soviet republics in terms of quantity and quality of
social buildings and structures. There was a range of resort houses, health
resorts, camps, hostels etc. The political will and accessible means allowed
solving at least the issue of temporary residency. Part of the refugees
succeeded to exchange their apartments and solve the issue of housing. 

There
was another issue. Nobody knew this situation is going to last forever. Most of
the people believed that it is temporary, Soviet authority will set the order
and will protect them. Only after the referendum of 1991 when several republics
decided not to stay a part of Soviet Union, wide public realized that the great
empire does not exist anymore and will not take care of them.

How many refugees did Armenia receive?

Totally
500 000 refugees and 360 000 came to Armenia. More than 120 000 directly from Baku emigrated to other
republics where they had job opportunities, relatives or friends.  The main part of refugees moved to Armenia in
November,1988.

Those
who had connections with Armenia
preferred to move here. There were also Azerbaijani Armenians who considered
their motherland not Armenia but the place from where they were displaced. They
moved to the republics of the Soviet Union where they had connections.  

What were the issues of refugees immigrated to Armenia in the beginning and what
are they now?

There
are three main issues of refugees which the state was not able to solve:
housing, job, language. I always declared that these three issues are specific
for the refugees, all remaining is a consequence.

Due
to the mentioned issues they appeared in poverty. One of the UN study had
confirmed that refugees are the poorest part of the society in Armenia
even among those who are in poverty.

I
do not discuss the legal protection and
human rights because these problems are common in Armenia.

The
language problem is solved among the new generation because they have attended
schools. While those refugees in age of 40 and older can not communicate in
Armenian so far, due to the absence of the state program on Armenian language
teaching.

I
think that people of middle age and older who moved here believe their life is
a failure. They did not feel themselves a minority in Azerbaijan.
They were building and establishing the country. And all of a sudden they
appeared in such a situation. This is a huge psychological problem and it is
amounted  to other 3 issues and it is
obvious what a psychological state have the refugees in Armenia.

What impact had the earthquake of 1988, Artsakh movement and the war for
refugees in Armenia?

These
all led to migration.  Just imagine,
there was no job, they had language problem, and the beginning of the war… The
refugees tend to fear because they were not usual refugees, they forcibly
displaced and there were many human victims.

In the middle of 1990 we had more than 360 000 registered refugees in Armenia. They
just wanted to live peacefully. However part of them saw no opportunity for job
and life and left Armenia. There were many high level professionals among them
who could not find a job due to the language problems.

How many refugees are left in Armenia and what is the responsibility of
the state in this regard?

I
do not know how many refugees are still in Armenia but it is not essential for
me. Armenia
still should fulfill its obligations as a receiving party. That is, whether Armenia was
intended to solve the problem of refugees is becoming secondary. After the
collapse of the Soviet Union, with the support from international society Armenia should
have found the ways to improve the situation of the refugees.

I
believe that the question of quantity of refugees left in Armenia is
improper. Suitable question is in relation to how many refugees Armenia has
carried out its obligations? Even if they are not in Armenia or have received
citizenship, they are still demanders. They at least should enjoy the right to return
and reparation. Nevertheless, our state had not solved the problems of refugees
ever. 85 percent of forcibly displaced people from Azerbaijan left their property
there and they have the right to that property but there is no structure to
deal with the issue. UN does not work on the issue as well and provides merely
humanitarian assistance.

How would you evaluate the housing policy of Armenian Government for refugees?

The
mere fact that there was no tent city in Armenia, minimal conditions were
provided. This is good but as an NGO representative who worked on refugees’
issues from the beginning, since 1995 I have strongly criticized the programs
aimed at providing refugees with houses. This was a cottage construction. First
of all the project was far from the idea of integration. On the contrary, it
contributed to isolation, in many places there were no infrastructures for
normal life: shops, schools, cultural centers etc.

There
were many unfinished buildings and I am convinced that money received as
humanitarian aid should have been used for housing. Finally, at that time the
apartments were not privatized and the state could have made the reallocation.
It was not a matter of budgeting; it was a matter of proper management.

Later
they have started to do something: reconstruct the hostels into the apartment
complex. Then the Migration Agency started to register the refugees and put
them to the waiting list for receiving the apartment. But there is no use of that,
there were no allocations from state budget for the housing of refugees since
2009. As a member of the National Assembly I have raised this issue every
year. 

The apartments which are distributed to the refugees were built by the funds
allocated before 2009.

I
believe that taking into account existing conditions: war, earthquake, collapse
of the Soviet Union the newly independent Armenia should have done a proper
planning and implemented the project by skilled management instead of using the
conditions as a justification of the situation. Changes in staff had not lead
to the change of the policy in the field.

Since
2000 I have not considered the issue of refugees as a separate issue. If the country
was not able to find the development model which could lead to progress until
2000, it will fail any project. And I believe that the project of housing for
refugees has failed as it happened with the project of housing for graduates of
orphanages. The same mechanism, same attitude and same pain...

What if we compare the policy of Armenia
with the neighboring Azerbaijan?

Armenia has done
more than any country could do. Do not forget that refugees in Armenia
constitute 12 % of the population. I think that compared to our neighbor,
Armenian government solved at least one issue: none of the refugees stayed
homeless. Azerbaijan
have chosen a more cruel way, it still keeps its refugees in tent cities.

We
have many people who are living in hostels and in habitations with poor
conditions but there are few cases when the refugees appeared in the street.

However,
while solving the issue of residence, the government had not solved the issue
of job placement, the most urgent issue today which forces people to close their
apartments and look for job in other places.

What are the legislative issues in your opinion?

Until 1998 Armenia
applied the UN Convention relating to the Status of Refugees and only in 2008
the country has adopted the law on Refugees and asylum.

The
issue is that the states who received refugees of the same ethnicity never
treated them the way they treated foreign refugees in terms of rights and
responsibilities. There is a gap in law.

We
constantly stated that it is unacceptable to exempt from the army service the
refugees who belong to the same ethnicity. 
Both the international practice and reality proves it is wrong.  

What
happened during the years? The refugees were mandatory and illegally drawn into
the army. Then they decided not to do so. This situation led to the split of
the nation. People asked why my son should
serve while the refugee should not.

We
have always declared that there should be a different approach to the issue of
Armenian refugees and foreign refugees. And for all those who state that the UN
Convention set the requirement for refugees to be exempted from the military
service, we have proved that the Convention says that the state alone decides
this issue.

The law on refugees, as it is, is not bad. Nevertheless, you know, there is
a huge gap between the law and its implementation.  

What is the state of refugees immigrated to Armenia from Arab countries
recently?

They
belong to a different group. Every year we receive people who immigrate to
Armenia from different countries and get the status of refugee. But there are
few cases, there are very few foreigners. Today the world is open; everybody
knows that the social-economic situation in Armenia is complicated. So I do
believe and I do hope that a significant flow is not expected.